Building a new kind of theremin...

I am planning to build an electronic instrument. However, I need help (any help you can offer at all). Here's the plan:

I originally wanted to build an Ondes Martenot (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ondes_Martenot), however have decided that the keyboard etc. will add far too much cost and complexity to the project. So, I want to build a theremin (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theremin) with a difference. It will be played with exactly the same technique as a normal theremin, but with the timbral capabilities of the Ondes Martenot. This would involve having seven "stops" (like in an organ):

Onde (O)A simple sine wave timbre. Similar in sound to the flute or ocarina.

Creux (C)A peak-limited triangle wave. Similar in sound to a clarinet in high registers.

Gambe (G) A timbre somewhat resembling a square wave. Intended to be similar in sound to string instruments, as the French title would suggest.

Petite Gambe (g) A similar but less harmonically-rich timbre than Gambe. The player can control the number of harmonics present in the signal by using a slider situated in the control drawer.

Nasillard (N) A timbre resembling a pulse wave. Similar in sound to a bassoon in low registers.

Octaviant (8) A timbre with a reinforced first harmonic whose intensity in the signal can be controlled by using a slider. This setting is analogous to the 4 foot stop in organ terminology.

Souffle(S) A timbre often described as white noise, but in fact pink noise of indefinite pitch.

It also has four speakers (of which I want to make three): a standard loudspeaker, a small gong used as the loudspeaker diaphragm, a lyre shaped speaker with strings to produce sympathetic resonances.

I want the entire instrument to be in a wooden housing, with a draw containing the controls linked to the "stops" and various loudspeakers; which I would like, if possible to have also housed in the instrument. I am hoping it will look somewhat like this:
[img]http://www.thereminworld.com/pics/Thereminists/Lev/leon_theremin_young.jpg[/img]

It is also important to me that the instrument has analog sound.

Things I would like to know:
[list]
[li]Is it possible?[/li]
[li]How will I achieve the various timbres?[/li]
[li]Where can I buy the electronic requirements?[/li]
[li]What components will I require?[/li]
[li]How much do you think an item like this will cost in terms of the basic components (the housing aside)[/li]
[li]Does anyone have a plan for building a theremin which I could appropriate?[/li]
[/list]

J Malice

Your name interprets as Just Mischievousness which fits for the design of this project.

Basic theremin principles are difficult in themselves to master in design and construction. I think your ideas are fascinating but unless you begin the journey of understanding and building yourself you will be hard pressed to find much design help, it is a secret society. Not really, but there are less than five people in the world that could attempt this and have success, you might be one?

The sound variety you hope to capture, well few if anyone ever post sound around here anymore, no wait I know someone.

[i]It is also important to me that the instrument has analog sound.[/i]

Analog, I am in agreement here! But this is the 21st century, why do you want to build a cabinet with an old school appearance.

What you want to do I think is plausible but you will be alone in most of your research.

This I know personally!
-

Welcome to Theremin World!

I'm not an electronics expert at all - they'll probably be along in a while - but I've hung around these forums long enough to know some of the answers. And to be the bearer of bad tidings. :-(

Forgive me for suggesting this, but your questions give me the impression that you are not a very experienced electronics engineer. I mention this because the apparent simplicity of the theremin is deceptive - you will not be the first to discover that building a theremin is an advanced project. The short, non-technical reason for this is that the theremin is designed to be sensitive to utterly microscopic changes in its environment, (i.e. tiny finger movements up to two feet away from it) which means it is sensitive to pretty much everything. Pernickety is an appropriate word here. And on this pernickety beast we place rigorous requirements of stability and playability.

So, is it possible? Yes. Given sufficient development time, expertise and so on... (including an experienced thereminist to tell you how well you are meeting the musician's requirements of the instrument.)

How will you achieve timbres like an Ondes Martenot? Studying Ondes Martenot circuits would be a good start, I guess.

Where can you buy electronic components? Er, an electronic components shop. (Yes, I am being sarcastic. Sorry - it's in my nature.)

No idea what specific components you will require or how much they will cost.

There are plenty of theremin circuits to be found online. Not so many that win the approval of the electronic engineers or thereminists here on Theremin World.

Here's a fairly good one - it's an early version of the Moog Etherwave Standard. http://www.cs.nmsu.edu/~rth/EMTheremin.pdf

Seriously though, if your budget runs to it, the best readily available theremin around is the current version of the Moog Etherwave Standard, [i]with the Frenkel Bass Mod[/i]. (http://shop.theremin.nl/TTM/modules.html)

My plan would be to start with one of those and research modular analog synthesiser modules that could be used to shape the timbre beyond the variations already offered by the etherwave.

... and here is probably the simplest Moog theremin circuit still used by a couple of professional thereminists - the Moog Melodia.

http://moogarchives.com/there61a.htm

Larger scan here (http://www.theremin.info/-/viewpub/tid/10/pid/49).

It has a good timbre (just the one), and a limited range - the article says three octaves - and I think it would make an ideal first theremin project. But... the article is 50 years old. Which means some components may not be available now. What it probably needs is someone who knows components to work through it and bring it up to date...

Maybe at first you could start with a very easily been done project like a "Theremin" which reacts by light (photoresistant element). Not, that this would be a good instrument at all, but to get an idea of difficulties to expect designing a complete.. synthesizer.
I agree with Gordon, the Melodia is a very suitable project. If you might want to design a more sophisticated one. Though even with those few components it might be hard to get any sound out of it.
Happy building!
Dominik

>you will be hard pressed to find much design help, it is a secret society. Not really, but there are less than five people in the world that could attempt this and have success[...]

Hardly! There is nothing magical or secret about the design of a theremin. It is a simple heterodyne principle that any RF engineer can readily understand and reproduce. Now, PLAYING one is a different matter...

Anyway, the original poster's objective is easily obtained with a bit of creativity. First, I would suggest a kit such as the PAiA Theremax whose design includes CV outputs for pitch, volume, and velocity. The actual audio output from the theremin is not used nor needed. Feed those CV outputs into most any analog synthesizer (could also be a kit) with at least two oscillators, a VCF, VCA, and ADSR envelope generator and the task is complete (save for building the cabinet).

True, designing a theremin is not difficult, if you have electrical engineering skills.

Designing one that satisfies thereminists' musical requirements - a [i]good[/i] theremin; stable, linear, playable, desirable timbre, useful range - that's a different matter. Bob Moog spent his life exploring different theremin designs and continuously improving the product...

Any carpenter can build a violin.

OregonJim said:

[i]“Hardly! There is nothing magical or secret about the design of a theremin. It is a simple heterodyne principle that any RF engineer can readily understand and reproduce. Now, PLAYING one is a different matter...”[/i]

Then you say:

[i]The actual audio output from the theremin is not used nor needed.[/i]


Obviously you have never had the pleasure to experience a true theremin. In my early research to discover the theremin I made gadgets to stimulate the masses as theremin projects but as the years passed realized I was leading people astray.

A true theremin begins with a heterodyne generated voice I agree, but then your last comment you mute it? That is like cutting her heart out with a butter knife!

A theremin can be magic or magical in every sense of the word. This is why the Beach Boys had great success with “Good Vibrations”. Don’t get excited group, Paul’s my neighbor.

GordonC once again a genius:

[i]“Any carpenter can build a violin.”[/i]


Christopher

>Any carpenter can build a violin.

Apples and oranges. The theremin is an ELECTRONIC instrument, not an ACOUSTIC instrument. Building or designing one requires no special skill beyond basic electronic theory. Now, designing one that meets a particular player's requirements for timbre and playability - well, that depends on the ability of both designer and player to communicate their requirements to each other.

Let me remind you of the original poster's wish:

He does not want a theremin THAT SOUNDS LIKE A THEREMIN. He wants a completely DIFFERENT instrument that is PLAYED like a theremin!

Don't misunderstand me - I readily acknowledge and appreciate Lev Termen & Bob Moog's contributions to furthering the instrument; but many people around here seem to suggest that the lack of theremin designers is linked to some sort of intangibly difficult gift. Did you ever consider that it's simply a lack of market? There's no rocket science involved! Not even overly difficult carpentry!

>A theremin can be magic or magical in every sense of the word. This is why the Beach Boys had great success with “Good Vibrations”. Don’t get excited group, Paul’s my neighbor.

Um, it was not a theremin that was played on "Good Vibrations".
It was a Tannerin - again, completely different instrument.

I think Christopher knows that - it was invented by his neighbour, Paul Tanner.

Yup, it's a boutique market, but with a top end theremin going on eBay for up to $6000 there is money to be made - possibly not big business money, but certainly enough to sustain a hobby - and if you are right then it's money for old rope.

I would dearly love to be proved wrong about it being difficult to design a good theremin.

(Funny thing about oranges - in some countries they are known as Chinese apples.)